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May27

Illinois unemployment benefits eligible?

Termination
Employee Warning Notice
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Employee Resignation Form
Exit Interview Questionnaire
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My husband was a store manager for over 5 years and had excellent performance reviews. This past Christmas a new store director was transferred to his store. He started riding my husband for no apparent reason. (He did tell my husband that he made too much money.) The store director began making his work life miserable. He was forced to work 80 hours a week and told he was not allowed to hire additional help. The store director kept yelling at him that stuff was not getting done, but he had no help and was already working an excessive number of hours. After working 80 hours a week for 2 months straight he got sick (had a Dr’s note for a few days off), extremely run down and sleep deprived. When the store director kept calling him and yelling at him numerous times he threw his work phone down and it broke. He did not mean to break the phone. He was just very frustrated. He was then escorted out and suspended until HR or the store director called him back. Despite calls and emails to HR, nobody contacted him for 3 weeks! So he was at home without pay for 3 weeks. Finally he emailed the regional director and then he was terminated for this “behavior problem.” We later found out that someone else from another store wanted his job and that they had been planning to get rid of him to transfer this other employee over to his position. They were delibertately trying to push his buttons to get him to quit. He had never had any written or verbal warnings from anyone indicating any kind of “behavior problem.” Can an employer suspend someone that long without pay or notification? They were obviously dragging out the suspension so they didn’t have to pay unemployment benefits for those 3 weeks. Could the employer consider this “misconduct” and deny unemployment benefits?

There’s an important lesson for every HR professional here. While it is sometimes necessary to fire an employee, it’s not necessary to torture them first.

Your reading of this situation is probably right. The new store director thought your husband was overpaid, and wanted to replace him. It would have been much more ethical and humane for the new director to just fire your husband outright.

If your husband had quit, there is a good chance that he would have qualified for unemployment. When an employer changes working conditions drastically (such as going from a 50-hour workweek to an 80-hour workweek) then often the employee is considered to have quit “for good cause” and can collect unemployment.

It’s not unusual for an employee to be suspended while HR conducts an investigation of the situation, but 3 weeks is a long suspension.

Unfortunately, your husband chose to have a fit of temper and destroy company property instead of quitting. (The excuse “I threw it down but I didn’t mean to break it” hasn’t worked since third grade.) There is a good chance that this will be considered misconduct and the employer will contest your husband’s unemployment claim. If your husband is denied unemployment, he has the right to appeal that decision. It’s possible that when he explains the complete circumstances, he will win the appeal.  

This entry was posted on Tuesday, May 27th, 2008 at 7:45 am and is filed under
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11 Responses to “Illinois unemployment benefits eligible?”

  1. Janet Says:
    October 6th, 2008 at 11:43 pm

    I am going through the exact same thing! Please tell me..did you ever receive unemployment? I need advice as I’m going through hell..

  2. Caitlin Says:
    October 7th, 2008 at 9:47 am

    Hi Janet! When you say you’re going through the same thing, do you mean your company has changed your working conditions? Or that you’ve been suspended or terminated for destroying company property? If you’ll post a few more specifics, we may be able to offer some advice until the original poster returns! HTH ~ Caitlin

  3. Janet Says:
    October 9th, 2008 at 8:52 am

    Hi Caitlin,

    Yes, I worked for my company for over 7 years and they created such a hostile environment that I reported it to HR, which ultimately led to termination. I was provoked into tearing up my emails for an event that I was working on because they purposely gave it to a younger girl who they were trying to replace me with. But my director said that my emails were too confusing and I honestly thought that they were useless at this point anyway. Even though ALL of the emails that I created were also CC’d to my director, they still said that I destroyed company property since it was on their computers and on company time. This is so lame and such a poor excuse in my opinion! If they try to deny my unemployments benefits then I will keep appealing until I win. I know that this was a setup since they are notorious for setting people up so that they’ll quit, this way they don’t have to pay unemployment. I have worked there for seven years and never once had any problems or complaints and have been a good and honest employee. Out of the blue, they decided that they wanted to replace me. This is just so unfair and now I’m facing losing my house because jobs are so scarce right now. Please advise…I appreciate any help I can get! Thank you so much! Janet

  4. Caitlin Says:
    October 9th, 2008 at 9:37 am

    Hi Janet! IMHO, it’s always a good idea for an employee to appeal, if they have been denied unemployment benefits. The process is relatively painless, and the employee has nothing to lose but much to gain if they win. In Illinois, the appeal is normally a phone interview that lasts 20 minutes or so.

    Sorry, but the “they provoked me” excuse just doesn’t work. Adults are expected to control their behavior. That’s why attempted murder is considered a crime, even if the victim is really, really annoying. I’m not clear on how one “tears up” emails on a computer — presumably you deleted all of them in a childish fit of anger. On the other hand, if you deleted the emails because your director told you they were useless and you thought that is what he/she wanted you to do…that’s a different story.
    No job lasts forever. You had 7 good years with this employer, before they decided they wanted someone else in the position. That’s about 4 years longer than normal. Many of the problems we see are caused by the fact that employees think they are entitled to the same job for life. But the days when that kind of unstated contract between employer and employee existed, are long gone. When an employee begins to suspect things are going bad, that is the time to start sending out resumes.
    The takeaway here is that an employee should never let themselves become so angry that they are out of control, regardless of the circumstances. It’s just not worth it. HTH, and thanks for reading the blogs!~ Caitlin

  5. Janet Says:
    October 11th, 2008 at 9:47 am

    Hi Caitlin,

    Actually, the emails I threw in the trash were just copies of the ones I had already sent to my director and were in my own personal event folder. All of the emails were already saved under my archives on my computer. Plus, everyone in my department keeps their own folders for their personal use and reference. I had not only CC’d my director, but had previously entered all pertinent information in the shared drive for everyone to access. The reason that I threw them in the trash is because he told me that my emails were confusing, therefor no use to anyone. This is why I believe that this is a very weak excuse to terminate me on their part. I am certain that their only reason for to replace me with someone else. Thank you so very much for your advise! I really do appreciate your help and will keep you posted. Thanks again, Janet

  6. Caitlin Says:
    October 11th, 2008 at 9:26 pm

    Hi Janet! Thanks for clarifying. Yes, we have to agree that this is a pretty flimsy excuse for being terminated, especially since you really did not destroy anything, since the entire company still had access to your emails on the shared drive. Best of luck to you, and feel free to post any additional questions you might have!~ Caitlin

  7. Janet Says:
    October 12th, 2008 at 1:20 pm

    Thank you so much for your support, Caitlin! I need all the help I can get right now. I will definitely keep you posted.

    Thanks again,
    Janet

  8. Roxi Says:
    October 20th, 2008 at 7:14 am

    I worked for a company for years as a sr mgr. At end of May the company restructered and I was demoted to mgr and my salary was decreased by $20,000. Since I had been such a great performer and I had recently been named mgr of the month in Feb I turned to every chain of command I could to get this resolved. This took a few weeks to give them the opportunity to try and save me. However,
    in the end they would not offer me anything and regretted that I left. I received a job offer from another employer and put in a notice. I left the job and started to work for the new company two weeks later. There I started and was laid off 3 1/2 weeks later. Now IDES says I proved that the wage decrease was a reason to quit but that because I stayed so long after the decrease (approximately 8 weeks) that I accepted the pay decrease. I didn’t, but I was trying to negotiate to stay. I am filing an appeal, how do I win this.

  9. Caitlin Says:
    October 20th, 2008 at 10:55 am

    Hi Roxi, You can present your case, but the IDES guidelines are pretty inflexible. In Illinois, as in many states, an employee who quits after being demoted or having their salary reduced, qualifies for unemployment. But when an employee remains for more than 6 weeks or so, it appears that the wage cut was not the issue. (In retrospect, it was probably not a good idea to try to negotiate this. Companies are not likely to restructure their business plan to accommodate the wishes of one employee. It’s like the ant wanting to reschedule the picnic.)

    Our experience has been that employees in Illinois who quit to accept another position, can collect unemployment if the second position doesn’t materialize. Presumably, they also can if they are laid off from the second position. So we’re not clear on why this is even an issue. You can also post your questions on our sister site at http://www.laborlawtalk.com. HTH, and thanks for reading the blogs!~ Caitlin

  10. Janet Says:
    December 28th, 2008 at 2:33 pm

    Hi Caitlin,

    I just wanted to give you an update. I WON my appeal for unemployment benefits! I also received my back pay from the date I was terminated. NOW, after receiving benefits for a few weeks, my ex employer is appealing AGAIN. Now they’re stating that I was insubordinate and they’re changing their story. I am so completely disgusted with their tactics and how they’re just NOT accepting the referee’s decision. I understand that it’s their right to appeal, but since they are not allowed to bring in new evidence, they are just pulling things out of thin air and are probably trying to harass me at this point. I still have no doubt that I’ll win, but it just makes me mad that they are being so persistent and vindictive in my opinion. I’ll definitely keep you posted. Thanks again for your advise! Janet

  11. Caitlin Says:
    December 28th, 2008 at 3:18 pm

    Hi Janet,
    What great news that you won the appeal!!
    You are absolutely right: the company has the right to appeal that decision, but they are only making themselves look bad by trying to change their story now. We suspect that you will win the second appeal, as well. Cheers,~ Caitlin

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